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Police Chiefs Will Back Open Carry Bill
December 11, 2015
Acknowledging “momentum” behind a proposal that would allow people with concealed-weapons licenses to openly carry guns, the Florida Police Chiefs Association said Thursday its board of directors had voted to back the controversial measure — as long as changes designed to protect law-enforcement officers are included.
A spokeswoman confirmed that the police chiefs’ group had contacted the sponsors of the proposal (SB 300/HB 163), Sen. Don Gaetz, R-Niceville, and his son, Rep. Matt Gaetz, R-Fort Walton Beach, who both say they’re on board with the changes.
“The police chiefs understand that momentum is building,” association spokeswoman Sandi Poreda said. “And because of their concerns for police officers’ safety, they wanted to go ahead and reach out to the bill sponsors and work on these amendments, which they believe will better protect officers.”
If the measure passes, 1.45 million Floridians with concealed-weapons permits would be able to openly carry guns. Opponents — including a number of Florida sheriffs — warn that people who openly display guns could get hurt as a result, either by criminals or law enforcement.
Gun bills will be heavily debated during the 2016 legislative session, which starts Jan. 12. Along with the open-carry proposal, lawmakers are looking at allowing people with concealed-weapons licenses to carry guns on college and university campuses and are considering a proposal to shift a burden of proof in “stand your ground” self-defense cases.
By a vote of 15-7, the police chiefs association’s board of directors — who represent law-enforcement agencies in different districts of the state — agreed to support the open-carry bill when the amendments are adopted.
In a “Red Alert” email Wednesday to association members, Executive Director Amy Mercer cautioned that the police chiefs’ group “reserves the right to oppose the bill in the future, particularly if our amendments are changed or removed or if other amendments are added that are found not to be in the best interest of the FPCA and our members.”
Lawmakers will consider four proposed amendments, which have not yet been filed.
One amendment would add a provision to the Senate bill. The amended version would include House language stating that a person who displays a firearm “intentionally … in an angry or threatening manner, not in necessary self defense” is not covered by the proposed open-carry law.
Second, both current versions of the proposal would allow fines to be imposed on people — including police officers — who infringe on others’ rights to openly carry guns, unless probable cause exists to believe that crimes have been committed. A proposed amendment would ease that standard for law officers, who would be required to have “reasonable suspicion” before stopping people to verify or investigate the carrying of guns.
Third, the current proposal states that no one who infringes on the right to openly carry guns — including police officers — would be immune from legal consequences. However, the agreement between the Gaetzes and the police chiefs association specifies that nothing in the bill would be intended to restrict a law enforcement officer’s ability or authority to conduct investigations as otherwise allowed by law.
“Sovereign immunity is a vital tool that allows law enforcement officers to perform their duties without fear of frivolous lawsuits,” Mercer wrote. “Officers will not fear losing sovereign immunity when investigating a person open or concealed carrying.”
The fourth amendment would require a holster for purposes of openly carrying a firearm.
The original versions of the bills have started moving through House and Senate committees. Matt Gaetz said Thursday he expects the changes to be added when lawmakers return to the issues after the first of the year.
“In the next committee in which the bill is heard, either the House Judiciary Committee or the Senate Judiciary Committee, it is my expectation that those amendments will be adopted,” Matt Gaetz said.
The Florida Sheriffs Association would not comment Thursday. But Pinellas County Sheriff Bob Gualtieri, a staunch opponent of open carry, said the four amendments wouldn’t make the bill acceptable to him — or safe for people who openly display their guns.
For instance, he said, if an officer arrives at the scene of a crime and sees someone with a weapon, “At a minimum, they’re going to be thrown down on the ground with a gun pointed at them — or worse.”
And if good citizen with a concealed weapon walks into, say, a bank during an armed robbery, Gualtieri added, “he’s going to take one in the chest because he’s a threat.”
“It’s not good for Florida, it’s not good for the economy, it’s not good for tourism,” he said.
Don Gaetz, however, pointed to the emerging differences between opponents such as Gualtieri and the police chiefs association.
“Well, he now will have the opportunity to debate that issue with his fellow law-enforcement officers who are taking a different view than he is,” Don Gaetz said.
National Rifle Association lobbyist Marion Hammer, who strongly backs the measure, dismissed the critics.
“That’s rhetoric. That’s reaching,” she said. “Every time we do something to protect the rights of law-abiding gun owners, somebody will come up with a ‘what if?’ ”
by Margie Menzel, The News Service of Florida
Comments
20 Responses to “Police Chiefs Will Back Open Carry Bill”
Dennis HE Wiggins
I suppose when i got pulled over for a seatbelt violation and handed the ECSO deputy my cc with my license it wasn’t a dangerous situation at all. He asked if i had a firearm with me. Yes. He immediately pulled his firearm, pointing it at me, ordering me to slowly exit the truck opening the door from the outside. Turning away from him, backing up slowly, kneeling down, crossing my legs with my hands on my head, i was placed in handcuffs (for both of our protection). Everything said and done i was essentially under arrest for about 30 min with my firearm returned ,gun, clip, and bullets seperated like i was going to shoot at him if it was returned otherwise. Whats the point of the 2nd ammendment or doing everything legal. You can say what you want, LEO do not like people with cc permits. And for everyone on the bandwagon, i know alot are well trained and on point yet when they shot the guy going for his cigarettes 1 time in the leg with 18 or so shots from less than 50 ft in his own driveway, lets me know why some act the way they do. Problem is, many just refuse to admit that some deputies just don’t need to be cops at all nomatter how gung ho they are.
Regarding the comment from the Sheriff about being thrown to the ground. I noticed that the Sheriff is in Pinellas County. The farther south in the state you go, the more I would expect that type of action from the LEOs.
One of the most important factors in dealing with LEOs is your attitude. In cases like that, make certain your hands are nowhere near the firearm. Be polite and – above all – do whatever the officer asks you to do. Usually they will give some type of command before they just throw you to the ground as long as they do not believe you are a threat to them or anyone else. They may direct you to turn away from them and kneel or something along those lines, but I don’t think aggressive behavior would be immediately displayed without cause – the least of which would be a feeling of danger.
I’m a 34 year LEO and a CC permit holder. I would never open carry without my badge exposed, period. By OC, you are telling the bad guy you have a gun. He knows exactly what he has to do in order to overcome his obstacles. In other words, he’s going to hurt you in a bad way.
Remember, the thugs of today are not like they were 10 years ago. Now they have no respect for life and will just walk right up to you, without provocation, and shoot you for that car/watch or candy bar. They don’t care. What they don’t expect is for you to say, “ok here’s my wallet”. Instead of pulling out leather, you clear leather. Problem over!
http://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2011/234/?Tab=BillHistory
Dan T, isn’t this the law protecting Florida CC from prosecution for accidental exposure?
Pensacola Pete you are mistaken, unintentional exposure is not protected in Florida. People are being arrested and convicted for even brief exposure. Please see the Norman case. Jeeperman please point me to one case where a open carrier was klonked on the head in any of the many open carry states?
I sure would like to open carry hiking, instead of having to sweat all over my gun.
My comment is toward Pinnelas County Sheriff Bob Gualtieri. The sheriff must not be familiar with Concealed Carry Law in the State of Florida. He Should know that carrying a concealed weapon into a bank is forbidden by Florida law. Seems only natural to me the law would be amended to include open or concealed carry in a bank. But as Gregory Boyd said “You will never SEE me conceal or open carry”.
You will never SEE me conceal or open carry. Hehe!!
Seems to me, the open carry privilege is working in our favor. We have 7 times the people of any other stare except California and yet there has not been 1 mass shooting in Florida.
COME ON PEOPLE YOU GOTTA HAVE COMMON SENSE
A Right not exercised is a Right lost. The Founders new exactly what they were doing and what it would take to maintain Freedom.
Tom, if those other countries are so much better than the the US then you are welcome to move there anytime. The 2nd Amendment guarantees our Freedom from All enemies foreign and domestic to.
I’m with that jeeperman.
Kinda makes it easier when they can “profile” the definite gun carriers.
If your desire is to be the criminals first target, then yes, open carry your gun.
If you want to be conked over the head from behind by a criminal bent on getting a gun for himself or to sell, then yes ,open carry your gun.
And no, you will not see the threat coming from far enough away to react and defend yourself. Real life is not the movies.
I am more concerned about being shot by a police officer than by a criminal given the predominant attitude towards guns in general. The following statement extracted from this article supports my position.
“For instance, he said, if an officer arrives at the scene of a crime and sees someone with a weapon, “At a minimum, they’re going to be thrown down on the ground with a gun pointed at them — or worse.”
The criteria for being “thrown down on the ground” seems inconsistent with the law and good judgment. This apparent policy serves as a good deterrent to those law-abiding citizens helping promote good behavior among the criminal element.
By “beating down” anybody and everybody who’s intent is to help you, you are saying you don’t want our help. I think maybe sometimes you do.
I truly believe once every citizen in this country flaunts there open carry weapon this country will be unlike any other western nation on earth. Do we really want to go back to the days of the wild west? This country has the most gun related deaths of any western nation on this planet, And of course guns are not the problem right? There will be a tipping point where citizens just put two and two together and wonder how in the world we let guns and automatic weapons take such precedent in this country and while other democratic countries have not including UK,Canada,Australia,Germany, Japan the list goes on….
A concealed carry permit holder who walks into a bank during a bank robbery “will take one in the chest because he is a threat”???? It sounds like Pinellas County citizens need to replace their Sheriff.
I welcome the OC policy! We as law abiding citizens must have the means to protect ourselves, the world is changing rapidly and it is sad it has come to this but it is what it is. Way to go Florida!
Unintentional exposure is already protected, that law was passed a year or two ago.
I’m all for open carry but with a proviso. I believe the CC permit should be displayed also, this would stop all the wanna be thugs from walking around like modern gunslingers. The proposed amendments mentioned in the story would limit leos from checking someone without cause but the lack of displayed permit should raise enough suspicion that the carrier doesn’t have a permit and is in violation of the law.
At a minimum legal OC would protect citizens from fines or loosing their license if the CC weapon is unintentionally exposed.
It’s about time Florida. We need to lead the way not always follow. The world is changing people and this open carry law would let criminals/terrorists know that Florida doesn’t want them here. I recently read “The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun”. So true